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cookingfat
Occasional Contributor
95 Posts |
 Posted - 30 Jul 2010 : 06:35:34
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Wynyard Park limited has a vested interest in seeing the Wynyard site developed, they stand to make a lot of money out of it.
However, the debate as to whether the interests of tax payers would be best served by pursuing a PFI funding initiative for the Super Hospital was best demonstrated by the new MP for Easington, Grahame Morris MP who stated in the North East Hospital debate in Westminster on the 27th July 2010; costs incurred through going down the PFI route of £5 million per year would be an extra £175 million over the 35 year pay back period. That's £175 million extra, that could go directly into patient care OR into Health Authority Chief Executives salaries.
In my book it must be a 'no brainer' not to enter into such a deal in the first place. Yet the Comrades within Hartlepool Labour Party are still hoping for a finance deal to save Wynyard. Shame they did'nt have the same commitment to Hartlepool Hospital. |
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steveL
Frequent Contributor
565 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jul 2010 : 08:08:53
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. . . and yet UNISON, the Labour Party's chief financial backers are vehemently opposed to PFI.
This 'Jewel in the Crown' of a posting was completed In Time for the Tall Ships |
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rabbit
Occasional Contributor
84 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jul 2010 : 11:13:06
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A Ramble:
The debate in the Westminster Hall on 27 July 2010, gave me the impression that the Minister was a bit dismissive of the approaches made by our local MPs. he looked as though he had been given the short straw for that day, when he would have preferred to be off somewhere else.
In his answers to the questions put by the MPs he said " The fact is that the decision was taken on affordability and on the fact that the trust was a foundation trust and so was free to seek other means by which to finance the project, rather than going to the Department for capital funding. Those decisions were taken because of the tough economic situation we inherited after 6 May and the massive deficit the country was left with. ".
i.e. you`re on your own mate! You should have found the money yourselves.
This is despite the general tory view that PFI for hospital building is a waste of public money.
The local PCT would have had to raise that money through PFI. ie a company/companies would have owned the hospital and the PCT would have paid for it`s use over its lifetime.
Our local PCT perhaps took the non-PFI route because of the current economic climate and felt that they stood more of a chance of getting the funding directly from the government coffers, rather than via PFI, which would have been eventually funded from the goverment coffers anyway! It`s a bit like renting your own home or paying outright for it.
If the PCT did/does do the PFI route, it would not have been able to continue with this payment method, as all the PCTs are to be shut down. So the money for running the hospital would have had to come from the new GP groups (or perhaps the HBC/Stockton BC/Easington BC.etc.
In the case of Liverpool Royal, the new hospital is to be built using PFI. I assume now that the PCT concerned will not be liable for ongoing payments, but that will transfer over to the local GP practices. (or the city council) Note that the present Liverpool Royal is not an old Victorian building but was built in the 1960-1970s on the edge of the city centre. So it is a similar age to our local hospitals. There have been various construction and maintenance issues there (we are back to Derek Hatton era?) and the PCT have given a justified case for it to be knocked down and a new building to go up in its place. The PCT there is one of a number of PCTs in Liverpool, and other hospitals in the immediate area include the Broadgreen Hospital (early 20th century build), the Sefton General (old Victorian build) and the Alder Hey Children`s Hospital, the largest children`s hospital in Britain (20th century build I think).
If we look at another area, Newcastle upon Tyne, the Freeman Hospital was built a number of years ago and is a benchmark for heart operations and modern Hospital provision for the North Tyneside area. I think it was intended to replace the Newcastle General , but the General is still operational to some extent. Also still running in Newcastle is the old RVI hospital (closely associated with the university). There are no doubt others in the area. While we cannot directly make a comparison with Liverpool nor Newcastle, at the end of the day I think that this area has been shortchanged by the government. The money for the reorganisation of the NHS has to come from somewhere, and it`s come from this area.
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testing times
Frequent Contributor
156 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jul 2010 : 11:18:56
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It occurs to me that the threatened closure of a town's A&E Department has often been enough on its own for people to take to the streets.
The events of the last nine years is, I believe, probably the worst example ever of how the health of a local population has been used like a political football to the detriment of the local people. The entire saga is nothing short of a public scandal.
Yesterday, the proposed closure of our own A & E was pushed to a couple of column inches on the front page of The Hartlepool Mail by a photo taken from the Big Wheel at the Headland Carnvival and a rogue who had siphoned off £9,000 to his bank account.
It appears that the town has been battered into passive acceptance that it is about to lose its Hospital and there is nothing it can do about it.
Why?
Because the people who we elected to represent us are no longer acting in our interests.
HTH puts it very well. Who Speaks for Us? No One. Not the Council, not the MP, not the PCT, not The Hartlepool Mail and certainly not The Hospital Trust. |
Edited by - testing times on 30 Jul 2010 11:20:06 |
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Christine Blakey
Frequent Contributor
1206 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jul 2010 : 11:49:07
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There is not much time to go, but I really feel we should all be standing along the side of the roads as people come towards Hartlepool next week with posters stating the hospital closure, dust on the headland, poor sewers, lack of respect for residents and the list goes on!
I did hear that people on the Headland are going to put sheets outside the window to display their discontent. Good on them as it is about time, local people protected their heritage, homes, health and well-being and I am sure that will get media attention! |
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rabbit
Occasional Contributor
84 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jul 2010 : 13:04:13
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A little early to shut the A and E isn`t it?
The extract below is taken from the a document(appendix) published in Dec 2009 by Monitor, with reference to the local Independent Reconfiguration Panel.:
Monitor oversees the running of PCTs. Under the government proposals, Monitor will apparantly continue to run in some form to oversee local running of Health provision.i.e. oversee our GP groups.
Recommendation
Until the new hospital is open, a midwife-led maternity unit and a paediatric assessment unit should be provided at UHH in addition to elective surgery and emergency medical services, taking into account best practice.
Another extract is:
4.2.4 The NHS Trust provides consultant-led maternity care at both sites. In 2005/06,2,018 births took place at North Tees Hospital and 1,680 at Hartlepool (2,005 and
1,698 respectively in 2004/05).
This makes a mockery of the claim that Stockton has twice the number of births than Hartlepool. I sympathise with the opinions of Stockton people that they would not wish to travel to Hartlepool hospital. If I was them, neither would I. The answer was either leave things as they were before or go for the new build.
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Edited by - rabbit on 30 Jul 2010 13:05:18 |
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Christine Blakey
Frequent Contributor
1206 Posts |
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rabbit
Occasional Contributor
84 Posts |
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steveL
Frequent Contributor
565 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jul 2010 : 15:54:17
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Absolutely not, Christine. This is Wright sucking up to the public service unions PCS and UNISON and no more - just like the rally in Victory Square.
Where is Wright's meeting to bring services back to Hartlepool Hospital or to oppose the closure of A&E?
This 'Jewel in the Crown' of a posting was completed In Time for the Tall Ships |
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Christine Blakey
Frequent Contributor
1206 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jul 2010 : 17:11:28
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I really cannot understand why there is no discussion of keeping Hartlepool Hospital?
Surely someone will ask that question?
Why has it not been asked already?
I did ask Iain Wright at that Rally. He said that it was due to doctor's consultation and statistics or something like that? He was busy with one of the people who had arrived that day so it was quite hurried but I really find it hard to believe that our MP would not consider this? I did appreciate it that he had stopped and talked to us when we caught up with him and asked the questions but I would still like to have more detail on why the Hartlepool Hospital is never mentioned?
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rabbit
Occasional Contributor
84 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jul 2010 : 17:37:11
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Medical director for North Tees NHS Foundation Trust David Emerton said:
http://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/teesside-news/2010/07/29/nursing-pledge-as-hartlepool-a-e-shuts-84229-26955399/
“The Momentum programme is all about moving care out of hospital where possible and closer to people’s homes. Adults and children who have had accidents and injuries will be able to go to One Life in Park Road.
Earlier in the year the PCT also said regarding the centre that:
http://www.hartlepool.nhs.uk/includes/press/PR_UPL_293.pdf
" An additional wing is also being constructed to house a day surgery facility and a minor injuries unit to treat cuts, bruises, breaks and sprains. This is planned to open later in the year."
I didn`t realised this wording meant closing the whole A and E.dept at the Hospital.
I don`t think the centre can be considered to be nearer to people`s homes,but it will be handy for people falling down in the shopping centre, or falling down after a night out in the town. 
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Edited by - rabbit on 30 Jul 2010 19:12:27 |
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cookingfat
Occasional Contributor
95 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jul 2010 : 18:03:51
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Received this from a close friend;
'I have just, this very minute been informed from a very reliable source that North Tees and Hartlepool Trust are casting around to buy or hire portacabins for installation at North Tees Hospital in order that their A&E department can cope with the potential influx of work from Hartlepool
I'm not yet down from the ceiling after receiving this information --- but my initial reaction is "Do they really propose to assess our condition in Hartlepool and then send us to a portacabin in Stockton --- ?
This while our star rated Hospital has a much acclaimed A&E department stood redundant !' |
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cookingfat
Occasional Contributor
95 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jul 2010 : 18:08:00
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I also received this from my friend;
'For your information O.R. >>>
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Mr. Iain Wright M.P.
I have been informed by one of our Save Our Hospital (Hartlepool) Campaigners that when She asked you what you were doing about the announced closure of our A&E department you advised Her that only six people had actually complained.
Please therefore allow me to be the seventh complainant.
I cannot ask that you accept any pre-dated complaints but I would here advise you that three consultants PLEADED for the A&E at Holdforth road to remain open.
Please don't insult me with the standard ex- Peter Mandelson phrase "Striving for the best available health services for Hartlepool" just tell me what you are doing to keep our Hartlepool Hospital open and to retain and return the services which have already been sent out-of-town.
On Tuesday of this week I heard very clear statements from the current central Government, live from the House of Commons, that Hartlepool Hospital would not be closed.
If I were to align that statement with the previous re-assurances from You, from Tony Blair and from John Reid I would wonder what concerns myself and my campaigners could possibly have and indeed perhaps your personal advice to "Switch the lights off and go home" is now appropriate.
By way of a second, but connected, question --- "who actually gave North Tees & Hartlepool NHS Trust the mandate to even attempt to borrow private sector money, on our behalf, to build an out of town hospital that we never wanted ? "
Campaigners,
I have just been informed, by one of our campaigners, that when She approached Iain Wright about the closure of our A & E and the nearer that brought us to full closure --- HE came out with his nowt-saying phrase "for the best treatment available etc. etc, "
When specifically asked if he was responding to ALL OF THE PEOPLE who were concerned with the A&E closure he said that only 6 had complained --- PLEASE do something about that statistic NOW--
By phoning his office on 01429 224403
By emailing him on wrighti@parliament.uk
OR by writing to:
Iain Wright MP
23 South Road
Hartlepool
TS26 9HD
Just a simple email, a phone call, or even a short letter from enough people would take away his right to infer that no-one was bothered
Our campaigner then offered to walk down a street of his choice and ask anyone around , of his choice, whether or not they were bothered about the closure.
HE DECLINED THE OFFER !
I'm also told by a campaigner, who has a close relative working in A&E, that three consultants PLEADED AGAINST the closure and therefore we are free to assume that they, like us, were overruled by civil servants.
Perhaps you may like to include that question to your MP' |
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snowy
Frequent Contributor
161 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jul 2010 : 21:53:27
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I took a good look at that so called One life centre to day (another twee marketing slogan) and the so called replacement for A and E, are they serious...? It's about the size of two semi's and this to serve a town of this size, or is it in reality a sort of health realted Tourist Information Centre where they just tell you to go to North Tees and give you a bus timetable, it's a glorified Spelk and Bee sting clinic, ... it appearswe've gone backwards as regards access to medical care and being bombarded with yarns about how it's better .... when we all know it's frighteningly not.
Does anybody actually know what the opening hours are for this pathetic mini clinic ...? |
Edited by - snowy on 31 Jul 2010 21:54:43 |
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Mea Culpa
Occasional Contributor
42 Posts |
Posted - 01 Aug 2010 : 11:06:31
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Ah, but the best part is if one of the 'ruling classes' (Wrighty et al) succumbs to a coronary etc. THEY will have police motorcycle/patrol car outriders to speed them to Stockton.
It is so much like the communist system of the ruling classes and their personal lanes on motorways etc. that it is unreal.
We have allowed the communist/socialist system to insidiously take over the UK.
Some MPs even think it is legal (for them) to steal money via fraudulent expense claims and we should just accept it as their 'right'.
We have avowed communist trade union leaders hell bent on destroying an airline because of union claims at Heathrow...even though the same union accepted the same working conditions for their members at Gatwick Airport!
So, if you see the old 'blues & twos' in your rear view mirror, make sure you pull into the kerb as quick as you can...you wouldn't want to delay treatment to one of those that allowed OUR hospital to go to the wall...would you?????????? |
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Wynyard/Hartlepool Hospital Issue
